The messianic question: Who lied? Be honest!

[Drashi]

Mike Brown touches upon it. Others skim over it. Some Messianics hint about it, but very few are willing to speak the truth...

...who lied?

Brown speaks of "Rabbinical" Judaism, as though the Judaism of today is not the Judaism of the time of Jesus, and that after Jesus died, the Rabbis conspired and changed everything. In fact, even Muslims know that the Rabbis changed the Torah since they claim that the name of Mohammad as a prophecy was removed from the Torah.

Perhaps this began with "Matthew" who says that the Jewish leaders (the grandson of R' Hillel was the head of the Pharisees) conspired and they paid people off to hide the truth. Maybe this is why there are so many Jewish conspiracies (we seem to own the Media and all the banks, but somehow I got left out from being on the receiving end!)

Every once in awhile I will encounter a Missionary (usually via email) who will tell me that he was once from a Jewish family (after pressing the issue, it was an assimilated family), and chose to become Messianic. And such a person tries to avoid the "conspiracy" approach and tries to act so accepting, that "I am not saying that your Judaism is wrong, I am just saying that all segments are updated forms.

However, such a person never admits that Messianic Judaism is a young movement, but instead says that it is based on the Judaism of the Rabbi called Jesus! In other words, while they cannot prove that what they practice is valid, they fantasize about it and then claim that "Oh, your Judaism isn't wrong, but it is not more right than my Judaism."

But such people are dishonest. In a recent email exchange, the person claims to have left his Conservadox (although I believe it was more Conservaform) Jewish family to become Messianic.

If he did not believe that their Judaism was wrong, then why did he leave it? He left it because he felt something was missing and he was attracted to the anti-Rabbinical position that the Messianics take. And these he felt that his parts were wrong but he was right. If not so, then he would not have left from wrong to do something not-right.

I finally, after a couple of weeks of emails, got him to admit that he felt that Rabbinical Jews were conned, and that Messianic Judaism is right. "Jews today cannot think for themselves but need to get their Rabbi to tell them what to do" was his final email to me. (He would also send me links like this one as proofs from the "expert" Mike Brown).

In other words, he is one of the rare ones: he told the truth and finally let go of the charade that "everything is the same" and "it doesn't really matter" and "can't we all just get along" position. He finally told me the truth: that somebody lied, and it was the Rabbis.

Typically, such an answer is never heard of! For example, we have verses in the Tanach that are mangled in the gospels. Obviously somebody lied. The "Oh, it's all the same" person will say that "Oh, the Rabbis also modified verses for a Midrashic expression", and will rarely ever tell the truth, which is that they believe that somebody did lie, but it wasn't them!

Rabbi Hillel, Meir, Akiva, and all of these giants - did they lie? Or were they fools and were easily led astray and propagated their disinformation to their students, deceiving them for reasons of control?

Nonsense.

And for the Messianic who comes and says, "Well, they could have done so...", such a person is hinting at their true position: the "Rabbinical" Jews are fools and the descendants of fools, while the Messianic Jews are practicing the real Judaism of Jesus.

More nonsense.

So the key to all of this is to get the Missionary to admit the truth. You may have to hammer it at them over and over and over, but eventually they will break and admit what they really believe...

Somebody did lie.

And now it's about "who".

Just something to ponder.

Eliyahu

[Nahal]

<cut>

Every once in awhile I will encounter a Missionary (usually via email) who will tell me that he was once from a Jewish family (after pressing the issue, it was an assimilated family), and chose to become Messianic. And such a person tries to avoid the "conspiracy" approach and tries to act so accepting, that "I am not saying that your Judaism is wrong, I am just saying that all segments are updated forms.

Ahh, every once in a while I get those pop ups, warning for a new update, I usely cancel them, but now I know what they are about...........

However, such a person never admits that Messianic Judaism is a young movement, but instead says that it is based on the Judaism of the Rabbi called Jesus! In other words, while they cannot prove that what they practice is valid, they fantasize about it and then claim that "Oh, your Judaism isn't wrong, but it is not more right than my Judaism."

They just admit that are a new offspring of standard xianity,
Everytime a new movement pops up they claim to be the renewed continuation of first century xianity. Same old fish........

< >

Nonsense.

< >

More nonsense.

< >

Somebody did lie.

And now it's about "who".

Just something to ponder.

Eliyahu

So true!

[FloridianKaraite]

I was raised as a christian,it's funny know that i look back and say to myself how did i believe in such a thing!they have all sort of ways for explaining everything,first they are overly concerned with satan they think he's the enemy of god and that he operated outside of god's world.No such thing tanach even says that god put satan here to test us.

[Sophiee]

So besides the 3 gods of the trinity they have a 4th god -- Satan.

[Drashi]

When one accepts that the sages were upright people that spoke honorably, honestly, and with accuracy, then they certainly declare that the Jews do not come from a heritage of lies. But when dismisses the sages of old, then one does otherwise, which is why we speak of them honorably. It is something else to consider when dealing with people involved with cults or actual segments of Judaism.

[Anonymous]

Brown speaks of "Rabbinical" Judaism, as though the Judaism of today is not the Judaism of the time of Jesus, and that after Jesus died, the Rabbis conspired and changed everything. In fact, even Muslims know that the Rabbis changed the Torah since they claim that the name of Mohammad as a prophecy was removed from the Torah.

Perhaps this began with "Matthew" who says that the Jewish leaders (the grandson of R' Hillel was the head of the Pharisees) conspired and they paid people off to hide the truth. Maybe this is why there are so many Jewish conspiracies (we seem to own the Media and all the banks, but somehow I got left out from being on the receiving end!)

One of the things I have found is that a lot of christians don't want to bother studying. They will blindly believe what they are told. (lazy?) My own mother asked her pastor if she had to read the "OT". He told her no only the "new" is important. Of course she hasn't even read that. She doesn't believe Jesus was "God" but she believes he was the messiah. She says it just "feels good and right to her." She doesn't even know what "messiah" is!

Of course the NT is filled with villifying Jews. But if you pay close attention not all of it does.

Acts 5 (New International Version)
33When they heard this, they were furious and wanted to put them to death. 34But a Pharisee named Gamaliel, a teacher of the law, who was honored by all the people, stood up in the Sanhedrin and ordered that the men be put outside for a little while. 35Then he addressed them: "Men of Israel, consider carefully what you intend to do to these men. 36Some time ago Theudas appeared, claiming to be somebody, and about four hundred men rallied to him. He was killed, all his followers were dispersed, and it all came to nothing. 37After him, Judas the Galilean appeared in the days of the census and led a band of people in revolt. He too was killed, and all his followers were scattered. 38Therefore, in the present case I advise you: Leave these men alone! Let them go! For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail. 39But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God."

It's passages like these...ones that go against the grain, that should wake people up. But...you have to look for yourself and stop blindly believing others!

[Emet]

Let them go! For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail. 39But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God."

According to that philosophy as a proof of the validity of xtianity then all the other religions must be of G-d too.